Discussion:
It's an energy crisis not a climate problem
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JTEM is right
2018-05-14 20:50:20 UTC
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Step #1:

Establish that there is in fact warming and
that unlike the constant fluctuations in
climate seen these past 2.6 million years,
this time there's a different cause.

Step #2:

Demonstrate empirically why slightly warmer
during an ice is something we would definitely
not want, that it would be a bad thing.

Normal people would consider it a good thing,
and clearly (empirically) better than any
known alternative.

Step #3:

Demonstrate empirically how we might (Pardon
the pun) "Freeze" the climate at some
arbitrarily chosen point.

If you need me to spell it out: Allowing the
climate to follow it's entirely natural cycle
is a death sentence for western civilization
and billions of people all over the globe. So
mankind doesn't just want to artificially
manipulate the climate, mankind needs to manipulate
the climate or the glaciers (already overdue)
will return some day, probably a lot sooner than
most people are comfortable with, bulldozing much
of the northern hemisphere and leaving the rest
of the planet cooler and drier.

...if we can really cause "Global Warming" by
burning fossil fuels, seems that it's an extremely
easy, convenient "Fix" to all of our climate
problems.







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http://jtem.tumblr.com/post/173898797553
Chom Noamsky
2018-05-15 19:37:36 UTC
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Post by JTEM is right
Establish that there is in fact warming and
that unlike the constant fluctuations in
climate seen these past 2.6 million years,
this time there's a different cause.
Demonstrate empirically why slightly warmer
during an ice is something we would definitely
not want, that it would be a bad thing.
Normal people would consider it a good thing,
and clearly (empirically) better than any
known alternative.
Demonstrate empirically how we might (Pardon
the pun) "Freeze" the climate at some
arbitrarily chosen point.
If you need me to spell it out: Allowing the
climate to follow it's entirely natural cycle
is a death sentence for western civilization
and billions of people all over the globe. So
mankind doesn't just want to artificially
manipulate the climate, mankind needs to manipulate
the climate or the glaciers (already overdue)
will return some day, probably a lot sooner than
most people are comfortable with, bulldozing much
of the northern hemisphere and leaving the rest
of the planet cooler and drier.
...if we can really cause "Global Warming" by
burning fossil fuels, seems that it's an extremely
easy, convenient "Fix" to all of our climate
problems.
But natchural climate is always best, no matter what it does.

If a 'roid the size of Mt Everest plows into the center of a continet,
cloaking the earth in sun-blocking particulate for years, causing crop
failure and mass famine leading to billions of dead...

... that's okay, because it's natchural!

Need to look at the grander scheme of things. In a few billion years
the climate will be liquid hellfire and the planet long unlivable, as
the sun burns out and grows into a red giant.

People generally can't grasp the significance of time scales that big,
but a gweenie will say, so what, what matters is existence tomorrow, not
existence billions of years from now.

Actually, it matters a great deal. The green cliche is premised on the
idea of sustainability, and truth be told, our existence on this rock is
100% guaranteed to be unsustainable. The end of life as we know it is
written into well-understood physics

A few billion years might seem like eternity, but humanity needs to
pursue the highest density energy sources possible, and use them to
colonize space. Who knows what we will have even evolved into when the
end of days come, if our successors even last that long. But I do know
that pursuing low-density shitty energy source is dooming any chance of
existence beyond the finite lifespan of this planet.

But hey, if humanity and its successors end when life on earth ends,
that's okay, because it's natchural! And the fact that 99.9% of species
that ever existed are EXTINCT is okay too, because it's natchural!

The universe doesn't care if we get rubbed-out tomorrow. Our molecules
will get recycled into new suns or whatever, and the universe will carry
on as if we never existed.

On the other hand, planetary catastrophes can be a good thing. The big
meteor that hit 65 mya killed off all the big dumb dinosaurs. That
created an opening for the mammalia, and he we are today ruling the
planet.

Climate change drove early chimp-humans out of the trees and into the
grassy plains, where we had to walk upright to see above the tall grass.
Climate change converted us from tree-swinging knuckle-draggers to
proper bipeds. Evolution is driven by environmental change, sudden or
prolong. The adaptable survive, the rest become neat fossils.

But hey, when we are long gone, there might still be a radiation-rotted
Tesla flying somewhere in interstellar space. If an extraterrestrial
race comes across it, the only trace of human existence left will
essentially be one giant WTF puzzler. No wonder the people who built
this artifact are extinct, they were so dumb they tried to drive wheeled
vehicles in the zero gravity vacuum of space. And not just dumb, but
actually dummies.

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