Discussion:
IEA predicts wind will dominate Europe’s grid by 2027
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Unum
2018-09-30 14:57:36 UTC
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https://arstechnica.com/science/2018/09/international-energy-agency-predicts-wind-will-dominate-europes-grid-by-2027/

This week, the executive director of the International Energy Agency (IEA)
told the Global Wind Summit that wind energy was likely to become Europe's
dominant energy source by 2027 and that it would grow from there.

Today, roughly 25 percent of the European Union's power currently comes from
nuclear sources, with coal and gas each delivering a little above 20 percent.
Wind constitutes 10 percent of the European Union's energy mix.

But by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
R Kym Horsell
2018-09-30 15:00:50 UTC
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Post by Unum
https://arstechnica.com/science/2018/09/international-energy-agency-predicts-wind-will-dominate-europes-grid-by-2027/
This week, the executive director of the International Energy Agency (IEA)
told the Global Wind Summit that wind energy was likely to become Europe's
dominant energy source by 2027 and that it would grow from there.
Today, roughly 25 percent of the European Union's power currently comes from
nuclear sources, with coal and gas each delivering a little above 20 percent.
Wind constitutes 10 percent of the European Union's energy mix.
But by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
Post by Unum
IEA's 2027 scenario.
--
[Another "corageous" perdiction:]

Will 2016 set sat records? Unlikely.
-- Chom Noamsky aka Kim "Capn Exponential" Dobranski, 08 Aug 2016

[As of 10 Aug 2016:]

Hadley SST :

year Jan-Jul avg(anom)
2016 0.6554
2015 0.5188
1998 0.4799
2010 0.4688
2014 0.4388
2005 0.3921
2002 0.3825
2003 0.3769
2009 0.3649
2013 0.3467

UAH LT v6 :

year Jan-Jul avg(anom)
2016 0.5842
1998 0.5828
2010 0.4085
2002 0.2514
2005 0.2114
2007 0.2114
2015 0.2100
2014 0.1799
2003 0.1614
2013 0.1414
Paul Aubrin
2018-10-01 07:08:03 UTC
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Post by Unum
https://arstechnica.com/science/2018/09/international-energy-agency-
predicts-wind-will-dominate-europes-grid-by-2027/
Post by Unum
This week, the executive director of the International Energy Agency (IEA)
told the Global Wind Summit that wind energy was likely to become
Europe's dominant energy source by 2027 and that it would grow from
there.
Today, roughly 25 percent of the European Union's power currently comes
from nuclear sources, with coal and gas each delivering a little above
20 percent.
Wind constitutes 10 percent of the European Union's energy mix.
But by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other
electricity sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other
Renewables" like biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas
adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to
just over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven
percent in the IEA's 2027 scenario.
German energy transition is a failure, according to German federal audit
office.

https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-wirft-
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html

As European states subsidies dry up, new wind farms will not replace
ageing ones. Wind generated energy production will start to decrease when
older wind turbines start being decommissioned when their 20 years
subsidies expire.
Unum
2018-10-01 14:14:18 UTC
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Post by Unum
Post by Unum
https://arstechnica.com/science/2018/09/international-energy-agency-
predicts-wind-will-dominate-europes-grid-by-2027/
Post by Unum
This week, the executive director of the International Energy Agency (IEA)
told the Global Wind Summit that wind energy was likely to become
Europe's dominant energy source by 2027 and that it would grow from
there.
Today, roughly 25 percent of the European Union's power currently comes
from nuclear sources, with coal and gas each delivering a little above
20 percent.
Wind constitutes 10 percent of the European Union's energy mix.
But by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other
electricity sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other
Renewables" like biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas
adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to
just over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven
percent in the IEA's 2027 scenario.
German energy transition is a failure, according to German federal audit
office.
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-wirft-
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor.
Post by Unum
As European states subsidies dry up, new wind farms will not replace
ageing ones. Wind generated energy production will start to decrease when
older wind turbines start being decommissioned when their 20 years
subsidies expire.
http://fortune.com/2018/02/06/europe-wind-energy-capacity/

Europe’s offshore wind industry is booming, with a 25% boost in capacity
during 2017.

Industry body WindEurope released statistics Tuesday that showed 3.1 gigawatts
of capacity came online last year, thanks to the installation of 13 new
offshore wind farms. One of those, Hywind Scotland, is the world’s first
floating offshore wind farm.
Paul Aubrin
2018-10-01 16:29:08 UTC
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Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
German energy transition is a failure, according to German federal
audit office.
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor.
CO2 emissions are stagnating. Electricity bills are exploding.
Unum
2018-10-01 17:01:22 UTC
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Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
German energy transition is a failure, according to German federal
audit office.
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor.
CO2 emissions are stagnating. Electricity bills are exploding.
Nope.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2018/09/international-energy-agency-predicts-wind-will-dominate-europes-grid-by-2027/

This week, the executive director of the International Energy Agency (IEA)
told the Global Wind Summit that wind energy was likely to become Europe's
dominant energy source by 2027 and that it would grow from there.

Today, roughly 25 percent of the European Union's power currently comes from
nuclear sources, with coal and gas each delivering a little above 20 percent.
Wind constitutes 10 percent of the European Union's energy mix.

But by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
Paul Aubrin
2018-10-01 17:11:51 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
German energy transition is a failure, according to German federal
audit office.
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor.
CO2 emissions are stagnating. Electricity bills are exploding.
Nope.
Germany no C02 reduction for years, but retail prices or electricity only
second to Denmark (if you except South Australia another wind turbine
champion).
Unum
2018-10-01 18:27:54 UTC
Reply
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Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
German energy transition is a failure, according to German federal
audit office.
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor.
CO2 emissions are stagnating. Electricity bills are exploding.
Nope.
Germany no C02 reduction for years, but retail prices or electricity only
second to Denmark (if you except South Australia another wind turbine
champion).
Why the sudden focus on Germany when the thread is about Europe's grid?
Wally W.
2018-10-02 02:42:08 UTC
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Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
German energy transition is a failure, according to German federal
audit office.
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor.
CO2 emissions are stagnating. Electricity bills are exploding.
Nope.
Germany no C02 reduction for years, but retail prices or electricity only
second to Denmark (if you except South Australia another wind turbine
champion).
Why the sudden focus on Germany when the thread is about Europe's grid?
If it doesn't work in Germany, why do you think it will work across
Europe?
JTEM is right
2018-10-02 02:44:41 UTC
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Post by Wally W.
If it doesn't work in Germany, why do you think it will work across
Europe?
"If you can't afford a car, buy two cars!"




-- --

http://jtem.tumblr.com/post/178651843661
Unum
2018-10-02 04:00:14 UTC
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Post by JTEM is right
Post by Wally W.
If it doesn't work in Germany, why do you think it will work across
Europe?
"If you can't afford a car, buy two cars!"
So it does actually work in Germany?


https://arstechnica.com/science/2018/09/international-energy-agency-predicts-wind-will-dominate-europes-grid-by-2027/

This week, the executive director of the International Energy Agency (IEA)
told the Global Wind Summit that wind energy was likely to become Europe's
dominant energy source by 2027 and that it would grow from there.

Today, roughly 25 percent of the European Union's power currently comes from
nuclear sources, with coal and gas each delivering a little above 20 percent.
Wind constitutes 10 percent of the European Union's energy mix.

But by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
Wally W.
2018-10-02 11:52:43 UTC
Reply
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Post by Unum
Post by JTEM is right
Post by Wally W.
If it doesn't work in Germany, why do you think it will work across
Europe?
"If you can't afford a car, buy two cars!"
So it does actually work in Germany?
No, it doesn't.

Nothing in the posts you quoted suggests it does.

<snipping your repeated spew. It wasn't impressive the first time.
Repetition doesn't make it smart or credible. Nor does it support your
misunderstanding of the German experience.>

Greenie-ism: If two wrongs make a right, then continent-wide
implementation of a horribly and obviously failed brain fart makes it
successful.
Paul Aubrin
2018-10-02 14:37:37 UTC
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Post by Unum
Post by JTEM is right
Post by Wally W.
If it doesn't work in Germany, why do you think it will work across
Europe?
"If you can't afford a car, buy two cars!"
So it does actually work in Germany?
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-wirft-
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html

Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is in
a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President of the
Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government threatens
to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy transition".

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator
Unum
2018-10-02 21:03:09 UTC
Reply
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Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by JTEM is right
Post by Wally W.
If it doesn't work in Germany, why do you think it will work across
Europe?
"If you can't afford a car, buy two cars!"
So it does actually work in Germany?
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-wirft-
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is in
a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President of the
Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government threatens
to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and "threatens
to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does actually work in
Germany.
Paul Aubrin
2018-10-03 11:50:37 UTC
Reply
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Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
Unum
2018-10-04 20:25:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.

by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
Paul Aubrin
2018-10-05 03:22:28 UTC
Reply
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Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
It doesn't.
Unum
2018-10-06 01:22:31 UTC
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Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
It doesn't.
When aubrin had to trim the thread to almost nothing, he admitted
that it does.
Wally W.
2018-10-05 04:32:21 UTC
Reply
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Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?

It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
John Smith
2018-10-05 16:04:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/

When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free
lunch, unfortunately.

As the world begins its large-scale transition toward low-carbon energy
sources, it is vital that the pros and cons of each type are well
understood and the environmental impacts of renewable energy, small as
they may be in comparison to coal and gas, are considered.
In two papers — published today in the journals Environmental Research
Letters and Joule — Harvard University researchers find that the
transition to wind or solar power in the U.S. would require five to 20
times more land than previously thought, and, if such large-scale wind
farms were built, would warm average surface temperatures over the
continental U.S. by 0.24 degrees Celsius.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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Unum
2018-10-06 01:20:15 UTC
Reply
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Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free lunch,
unfortunately.
You're point being?
John Smith
2018-10-06 16:27:56 UTC
Reply
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Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free
lunch, unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL

All energy production causes climate changes.
Unum
2018-10-07 17:38:24 UTC
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Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free lunch,
unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL
All energy production causes climate changes.
So what?
Wally W.
2018-10-07 17:46:39 UTC
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Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free lunch,
unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL
All energy production causes climate changes.
So what?
All climate change is bad.

All energy production must cease.

Surely, this is clear to any black-and-white thinking greenie.
John Smith
2018-10-08 18:21:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free
lunch, unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL
All energy production causes climate changes.
So what?
Your hypocrisy is confirmed.
Unum
2018-10-09 14:20:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free
lunch, unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL
All energy production causes climate changes.
So what?
Your hypocrisy is confirmed.
Yawn. Coal plants versus wind turbines, which contributes more to
global warming?

by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
John Smith
2018-10-10 20:44:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a
free lunch, unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL
All energy production causes climate changes.
So what?
Your hypocrisy is confirmed.
Yawn. Coal plants versus wind turbines, which contributes more to
global warming?
Which employs more humans?
Post by Unum
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
So we get to save our 300 years of fossil fuel reserves, sweet!
Unum
2018-10-10 21:29:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy
transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines
to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free
lunch, unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL
All energy production causes climate changes.
So what?
Your hypocrisy is confirmed.
Yawn. Coal plants versus wind turbines, which contributes more to
global warming?
Which employs more humans?
Cowardly evasion noted.

https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2018/05/energy-jobs-reports-say-solar-dominates-coal-but-wind-is-the-real-winner/

"The wind energy sector was the big winner here, as it employed 107,000 people
in 2017"

"coal-fueled electricity generation did not see any new jobs added or any jobs
lost, hanging to 92,000 jobs total"
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
So we get to save our 300 years of fossil fuel reserves, sweet!
Right, they have to stay in the ground indefinitely.
John Smith
2018-10-10 21:53:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy
transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government
of having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy
supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said
President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal
Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other
electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal
declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven
percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a
free lunch, unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL
All energy production causes climate changes.
So what?
Your hypocrisy is confirmed.
Yawn. Coal plants versus wind turbines, which contributes more to
global warming?
Which employs more humans?
Cowardly evasion noted.
Yours.
Post by Unum
https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2018/05/energy-jobs-reports-say-solar-dominates-coal-but-wind-is-the-real-winner/
"The wind energy sector was the big winner here, as it employed 107,000
people in 2017"
"coal-fueled electricity generation did not see any new jobs added or any jobs
lost, hanging to 92,000 jobs total"
Revive it and see what happens.

https://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/terence-p-jeffrey/us-has-lost-191000-mining-jobs-september-2014
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
So we get to save our 300 years of fossil fuel reserves, sweet!
Right, they have to stay in the ground indefinitely.
No they don't "have to" at all.
Unum
2018-10-11 03:36:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy
transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of
having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy
supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said
President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal
Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other
electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20
percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal
declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven
percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free
lunch, unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL
All energy production causes climate changes.
So what?
Your hypocrisy is confirmed.
Yawn. Coal plants versus wind turbines, which contributes more to
global warming?
Which employs more humans?
Cowardly evasion noted.
Yours.
My response is a few lines down, coward.

I'll ask you again. Coal plants versus wind turbines, which contributes
more to global warming?
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2018/05/energy-jobs-reports-say-solar-dominates-coal-but-wind-is-the-real-winner/
"The wind energy sector was the big winner here, as it employed 107,000
people in 2017"
"coal-fueled electricity generation did not see any new jobs added or any jobs
lost, hanging to 92,000 jobs total"
Revive it and see what happens.
Are you going to pay for it personally?
Post by John Smith
https://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/terence-p-jeffrey/us-has-lost-191000-mining-jobs-september-2014
So wind employs way more than coal. Aren't you glad?
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
So we get to save our 300 years of fossil fuel reserves, sweet!
Right, they have to stay in the ground indefinitely.
No they don't "have to" at all.
According to the IPCC and 99% of the world's climate scientists, they do.
Wally W.
2018-10-11 03:51:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Wally W.
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Germany threatened with final loss of control at the energy
transition
The Federal Audit Office has accused the federal government of
having
largely failed to control the transformation of energy systems. The
expenditure for the ecological reconstruction of the energy
supply is
in a "glaring disproportion to the so far poor yield", said
President
of the Court of Audit Kay Scheller in Berlin: "The Federal
Government
threatens to fail with its inter-generational project of the energy
transition".
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor, and
"threatens to fail" is not the same thing as "failed". So it does
actually work in Germany.
No one is bound to do the impossible.
So it does actually work in Germany.
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other
electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix.
Why might that be?
It wouldn't have anything to do with government mandates to maximize
the use of wind power even if it means idling cost-effective and
reliable coal plants that can pull their weight all day long ... along
with the weight of the loafing windmills when they flake out, would
it?
Post by Unum
"Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20
percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal
declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven
percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2018/10/large-scale-wind-power-has-its-down-side/
When it comes to energy production, there’s no such thing as a free
lunch, unfortunately.
You're point being?
TNSTAAFL
All energy production causes climate changes.
So what?
Your hypocrisy is confirmed.
Yawn. Coal plants versus wind turbines, which contributes more to
global warming?
Which employs more humans?
Cowardly evasion noted.
Yours.
My response is a few lines down, coward.
I'll ask you again. Coal plants versus wind turbines, which contributes
more to global warming?
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2018/05/energy-jobs-reports-say-solar-dominates-coal-but-wind-is-the-real-winner/
"The wind energy sector was the big winner here, as it employed 107,000
people in 2017"
"coal-fueled electricity generation did not see any new jobs added or any jobs
lost, hanging to 92,000 jobs total"
Revive it and see what happens.
Are you going to pay for it personally?
Post by John Smith
https://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/terence-p-jeffrey/us-has-lost-191000-mining-jobs-september-2014
So wind employs way more than coal. Aren't you glad?
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
Post by John Smith
Post by Unum
by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
So we get to save our 300 years of fossil fuel reserves, sweet!
Right, they have to stay in the ground indefinitely.
No they don't "have to" at all.
According to the IPCC and 99% of the world's climate scientists, they do.
So there is *no* safe level of burning fossil fuels?

Uncle Al (when sci.physics was a much better group): Conservation
means somebody else in the future deserves to consume it; and not
them, either.
Paul Aubrin
2018-10-02 14:30:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
German energy transition is a failure, according to German federal
audit office.
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor.
CO2 emissions are stagnating. Electricity bills are exploding.
Nope.
Germany no C02 reduction for years, but retail prices or electricity
only second to Denmark (if you except South Australia another wind
turbine champion).
Why the sudden focus on Germany when the thread is about Europe's grid?
Because Germany is the most populated and industrial country, and because
Germany electric generation is mostly coal and gas based?
Unum
2018-10-02 21:04:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Paul Aubrin
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
German energy transition is a failure, according to German federal
audit office.
https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/article181690102/Bundesrechnungshof-
wirft-
Post by Unum
Post by Paul Aubrin
Regierung-Versagen-bei-Energiewende-vor.html
Merely says that management of the transition has been poor.
CO2 emissions are stagnating. Electricity bills are exploding.
Nope.
Germany no C02 reduction for years, but retail prices or electricity
only second to Denmark (if you except South Australia another wind
turbine champion).
Why the sudden focus on Germany when the thread is about Europe's grid?
Because Germany is the most populated and industrial country, and because
Germany electric generation is mostly coal and gas based?
But by 2027, IEA's forecasts (PDF) put wind just beating all other electricity
sources with a 23-percent share of the energy mix. "Other Renewables" like
biomass plants contribute a little over 20 percent, gas adds 20 percent,
nuclear contributes just a little below 20 percent, and coal declines to just
over 10 percent. Solar energy contributes about six or seven percent in the
IEA's 2027 scenario.
$27 TRILLION to PAY for KYOTO
2018-10-03 02:39:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
E-n-e-r-g-y P-o-v-e-r-t-y on a MASSIVE scale coming.
DESMODUS
2018-10-11 10:09:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Not very likley as over 60% of the early tubines are out of action due to gearbox failure or pylon failure (why did the used the useless grouing method -they were told they would fail ! DESMODUS (there are 20% no wind days !)
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